Wild Caught snakes for sale overseas

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Wild Caught snakes for sale overseas

Postby Lourance Klose » Tue Aug 20, 2013 8:22 pm

I was directed to a post on an overseas forum. It truly saddened me by what I saw, how people can openly advertise snakes which are clearly from illegal sources. To see a snake like Lamprophis fiskii been openly sold with known wild caught origins, even to the year in which it was caught.

http://venomland.forumotions.net/t6919- ... ce-reduced
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Re: Wild Caught snakes for sale overseas

Postby Fooble » Tue Aug 20, 2013 9:04 pm

caudalis costing more than fiskii?

Ludicrous.
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Re: Wild Caught snakes for sale overseas

Postby it_bit_me » Tue Aug 20, 2013 9:35 pm

Hackett ??? The problem is that the expert smugglers don't get them to breed. It would be much better if he chose to keep them in SA till there are a few more to go around.
If I'm gonna be an old, lonely man, I'm gonna need a thing, you know, a hook, like that guy on the subway who eats his own face. So I figure I'll be Crazy Man with a Snake, y'know. Crazy Snake Man. And I'll get more snakes, call them my babies, kids won't walk past my place, they will run. "Run away from Crazy Snake Man, " they'll shout!”
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Re: Wild Caught snakes for sale overseas

Postby Bushviper » Wed Aug 21, 2013 2:21 pm

I am fairly sure these left the country legally. KZN does not regulate these animals and they were sold specifically because they are going to be listed on TOPS and as such getting a mate would be more difficult. Protecting the species sometimes does not have the desired effect. As of today nothing about exporting these snakes would be illegal or difficult from KZN.
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Re: Wild Caught snakes for sale overseas

Postby Lourance Klose » Wed Aug 21, 2013 3:24 pm

Arno, we do know the snakes left the country legally, but we also know they were collected illegally and certain species continue to be collected purely for financial gain. As we know there are a group of guys who feel they have the right to collect almost every single specimen which they come across and then sell. Some even go as far as catching gravid females and then claiming they are captive breeding them.

I just feel that the hobbyists need to stand together and stop buying animals from the poachers, it is giving them motivation to continue. I do understand that there are species out there that are "dream species" for hobbyist, maybe if the authorities could see that the hobbyists are standing together to root out the poaching than hopefully in the future they will support the hobby to a degree and allow the legal collection of certain species for captive breeding programs purely for the hobby.
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Re: Wild Caught snakes for sale overseas

Postby it_bit_me » Wed Aug 21, 2013 4:30 pm

I made that mistake. Snakes were sold as quarantined and eating but they arrived injured and dehydrated. It has now been a year and I have to go through a lot of trouble to get my money back.
Sad part is the person doesn't seem to grasp that there could be much bigger problems if I have to give all the info needed to end up where I was before meeting him.
If I'm gonna be an old, lonely man, I'm gonna need a thing, you know, a hook, like that guy on the subway who eats his own face. So I figure I'll be Crazy Man with a Snake, y'know. Crazy Snake Man. And I'll get more snakes, call them my babies, kids won't walk past my place, they will run. "Run away from Crazy Snake Man, " they'll shout!”
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Re: Wild Caught snakes for sale overseas

Postby Bushviper » Wed Aug 21, 2013 5:08 pm

Lourance I would love to tell you that what you said is true, reasonable and implementable however the reality is that most of the officials see as not only as the opposition they see us as Satan himself.

I have wasted my time at more meetings than what I care to remember, in my private capacity, where they are attending in their official capacity and my taxes are paying them to be there. We agree to something and then a few months later when the minutes are distributed or the act is passed it does not even resemble what we agreed upon. I dont know who to blame. Surely it cannot be the officials who sat with me, drank tea with me, told me they understood my reasoning, agreed on the solution which would satisfy both parties and then go screw it up when they publish the result.

I have been to meetings where they refused that we record the meeting. Now why would you do that if you have nothing to hide?

This has been at various provinces and also at National level. I dont have an answer for it. I just want to know who the gremlin is that changes what we agree upon. The parts that we have achieved have been monumental breakthroughs.

I have had an MEC look me in the eye while touching my arm and say "I will not implement this change in the act" and then they go ahead and do it anyway. This was after we reminisced how she was caught when smuggled a letter while in jail. I am not going to mention names now either.
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Re: Wild Caught snakes for sale overseas

Postby mrtsnakes » Thu Aug 22, 2013 8:45 pm

Fooble wrote:caudalis costing more than fiskii?

Ludicrous.


800 euro for one fisk, where the Caudalis is for 2.2.
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Re: Wild Caught snakes for sale overseas

Postby Fooble » Sat Aug 24, 2013 4:29 pm

mrtsnakes wrote:
Fooble wrote:caudalis costing more than fiskii?

Ludicrous.


800 euro for one fisk, where the Caudalis is for 2.2.


1:1 for 900, 2:2 available.
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Re: Wild Caught snakes for sale overseas

Postby croteseeker » Sat Aug 24, 2013 10:13 pm

Bushviper wrote:Lourance I would love to tell you that what you said is true, reasonable and implementable however the reality is that most of the officials see as not only as the opposition they see us as Satan himself.

I have wasted my time at more meetings than what I care to remember, in my private capacity, where they are attending in their official capacity and my taxes are paying them to be there. We agree to something and then a few months later when the minutes are distributed or the act is passed it does not even resemble what we agreed upon. I dont know who to blame. Surely it cannot be the officials who sat with me, drank tea with me, told me they understood my reasoning, agreed on the solution which would satisfy both parties and then go screw it up when they publish the result.

I have been to meetings where they refused that we record the meeting. Now why would you do that if you have nothing to hide?

This has been at various provinces and also at National level. I dont have an answer for it. I just want to know who the gremlin is that changes what we agree upon. The parts that we have achieved have been monumental breakthroughs.

I have had an MEC look me in the eye while touching my arm and say "I will not implement this change in the act" and then they go ahead and do it anyway. This was after we reminisced how she was caught when smuggled a letter while in jail. I am not going to mention names now either.


I feel your pain, man. In the US, we have the Lacey act, which is meant to stop the illegal trade of animals. In some respects, it's nice to have such a law on the books. But then you realize it does almost nothing to deter illegal collectors and it makes you want to scream. They're spending all this time and money trying to outlaw large constrictors, and meanwhile they catch a guy collecting and selling rare Arizona rattlesnakes and gila monsters and he gets off with probation and a minimal fine. :smt013

ALL wild caught animals from Arizona are illegal to buy, sell, or trade. The diversity of desirable species make it one of the hardest-hit herp locales in the world. It disgusts me to see some of our rarest rattlesnakes plucked from the wild and sold to collectors. Case in point, the white specks from the ad in question.

Those specks are found in only two tiny mountain ranges (in the middle of a military bombing range) in SW AZ, with a total habitat area of maybe only 20 square Kilometers. Last I heard, they were being studied to determine whether or not they deserve subspecies status, due to their abnormally small size. If I knew the names of the field collectors, I'd report them and do everything in my power to make sure they never see another American visa, let alone a range permit or a hunting license. Unfortunately, even though that's about the only form of action available to me, it's also the one least likely to do any good. :smt011
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Re: Wild Caught snakes for sale overseas

Postby Shaun » Tue Aug 27, 2013 10:48 pm

Bushviper wrote:Lourance I would love to tell you that what you said is true, reasonable and implementable however the reality is that most of the officials see as not only as the opposition they see us as Satan himself.

... I just want to know who the gremlin is that changes what we agree upon. ...


Arno I have also been personally involved in conservation meetings were the recorded conclusion was unrelated to the agreements made. The majority of these decisions were often made behind closed doors without due consideration for the animals or the environment.
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