To breed or not to breed: Enigmas

Re: To breed or not to breed: Enigmas

Postby Docmorrie » Mon Jan 27, 2014 10:03 pm

@Dylan: Way more experience than you boet, way more. You are making a fool of yourself, so please do continue with your arrogant and ignorant utterances. You are incapable of participating in a healthy and meaningful conversation. How dare you attack my breeding ethics and character on a public forum?! Who the hell do you think you are? You spit your venom all over this forum and then you dare to ask why people treat you the way they do? Let me know if you need a prescription for high doses Imodium, because I will appreciate it if you could take your cr@p elsewhere.
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Re: To breed or not to breed: Enigmas

Postby Frank » Mon Jan 27, 2014 10:42 pm

Dylan I have to echo Morne's sentiments. Everytime there is a debate you seem to think everone is ganging up on you and you then get defensive and start slinging mud at people. You try to make out that you are the victim but with the way that you respond to people I'm not surprised you get the feeling that people dislike you. I for one can say that after conversing with you on this forum and viewing your posts in general that you would be 100% correct if you thought that I wasn't your biggest fan.
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Re: To breed or not to breed: Enigmas

Postby froot » Tue Jan 28, 2014 8:55 am

Who always gets the last say in an argument, the chop or the gentleman?

Rabid.Evo8691 don't think for a second that communication with leaders in the field makes you an authority of some kind, they would probably prefer not to associate themselves with you in the real world. And let's say for arguments sake it did, your condescending tone would still be met with rejection. The fact that you didn't engage this thought process before you started typing brings across wafts of immaturity and needing to be recognized. You can fulfill those needs easily, but differently.

Responding with 'I never said that....' followed by a heap of justifications and then ending with a stab of some sort wouldn't suprise me, but I urge you to try understand what I'm saying. I've seen members with this sort of conduct come and go time and again and never profit.

Docmorrie you held yourself all the way through until the last post where the wheels fell off, cool it and report offences instead.

This topic is on the edge of the cliff of lockedness.
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Re: To breed or not to breed: Enigmas

Postby Rabid.Evo8691 » Tue Jan 28, 2014 9:14 pm

1. This is my point- Egos get burnt and things turn ugly. At the end of the day it is about the animals not us because without them WE are nothing!!! A little less self appraisal and a little more to the basics and drawing boards.

2. This was my post and I find this comical that in the end my post ended up not being used as an educational tool but to build inconclusive nothings with regards to my personality and my ethics.

3. Leopard gecko breeding ethics in this country sucks and I won't just allow it to happen when I am aware of what is going on. That would make me equally as guilty

4. Read .1 Who is truly an authority person that has posted in this page????
People that have been keeping leopard geckos just as long as I have

5. Not once did I attack anybody personally on this page. Ethics and a persons individual emotions are two different things. It is not my fault that the truth hurts and people turn sour.

6. There is other breeders in our country that have mutual feelings about the matter.

7. Actually there are professional breeders { just like us- human} that do get along with me not that I have to justify anything.

8. This isn't a popularity contest and your opinions mean nothing. Ethics does!!!

9. It is strange that none of my questions get an answer but I answer every question laid back at me. Why are the albino strains being crossed??? It is not ethical and don't say it is. There are tons of resources out there validating my point.

10. Breeders buy expensive mutations and genes not people interested only in pets. If I am incorrect then why is it that only 4 people own the white and yellow gene. How many people own Mack snows, Rainwaters etc.

11. I won't talk on someone else's behalf unless confidentiality is used. A current reputed leopard gecko breeder naively bought a pair of Bell sunglows het for Tremper a few years back ( Which the breeder never informed him that the 2 albino genes are incompatible). Recently he questioned the breeder about this and got the same attitude I have received. I find this disturbing as it seems that certain people only want to protect their investments. Ethics protects your investments. He is so angry at the moment and believes that his name has been tarnished unfairly and by people that couldn't care less about anything more than money.

12. That same breeder tried to sabotage me by getting a local petshop owner by me ( a feeder food supplier) to buy a Bell sunglow thinking I wouldn't question the het antics. I asked the petshop owner if it was het for Tremper and his response was yes it is. I can back up my statements but will not on this forum. How ethical is it to mess up my colonies genetics. At least I have experience that helped me figure it out. Yet I am stupid.

13. I am here to stay and none of you have earned any status whatsoever to judge my integrity and being the expert on who I am. Your words are weak and your lack of ethics is strong.
I have the right to point my views on what I want and defend myself as all of you seem to do.

14. This matter will be resolved by the one person whose opinion does indeed matter and he is totally mutual about everything as I did speak to him over the phone this past weekend. It is funny that he doesn't mix the 3 albino strains. This is completely bias and I have one message: Welcome to the 21st century where competition is not frowned upon. We will all meet sometime and then I won't be alone like here on this forum.
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Re: To breed or not to breed: Enigmas

Postby Rabid.Evo8691 » Wed Jan 29, 2014 10:57 am

Hi this is Dylan's fiance (Evangeline). I have been sitting on the side for a few months reading all the posts. And I can't believe how everyone here is always trying to know more than the other! When Dylan joined this forum he was so excited that he could learn from others and teach others what he has learned! And i know Dylan has a bad temper but wouldn't you if from the first day on this forum you got attacked! (I will not mention names you know who you are and who this is dedicated to!). Let me tell you now Dylan knows more than you think!

I have been breeding since i was 15 and never in my life have i seen this much hostility! (we don't have that in the snake world). All of you should forget about the money and the I know more competition and go back to the roots! It is about the ANIMALS and their beauty and how different they are, their personalities!

This hobby is becoming a joke! (I receive emails from people laughing at all of you) I am in the middle of everything i get the emails were people are to scared to ask questions (because of the non stop attacks).
You should be ashamed of what you are doing to the hobby!
I do agree if you don't agree on what someone is saying say so and why but don't be mean about it!

Breeders should stand together and help each other not fight!

Stop acting like children this is a place to learn not to show off! And the so called friendships on here i have received so many sms's and emails where you are bad mouthing one another. (loyalty means a lot).

If we ever have to come together in the future to fight for our beautiful reptiles (for what so ever reasons). I feel sorry for the real passionate keepers!

Just because you successfully produced leo's you think you are so great guess again (It takes more than that).
And I can truly say there is only one good breeder and that's Henry his heart in the right place. As for Dylan his was until he joined this form and met you!

And I don't care what you have to say about me, I know why I am in the hobby and what is important to me!
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Re: To breed or not to breed: Enigmas

Postby Rabid.Evo8691 » Wed Jan 29, 2014 11:49 am

Everyone is always quick to judge everyone on here. Maybe you should look further and see your own mistakes! (ganging up against one person just shows everyone who you truly are). Take a look and see who you are becoming.

The animals are what should be important and their health not your wealth.
The love for the reptiles is what it seems like you are forgetting!
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Re: To breed or not to breed: Enigmas

Postby H.P Kemp » Wed Jan 29, 2014 3:05 pm

Hi Guys. Very interesting debate.
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Re: To breed or not to breed: Enigmas

Postby H.P Kemp » Wed Jan 29, 2014 3:27 pm

I have read all the posts. I am going to comment in due course openly to each person. We all have a right to our opinion and what worked in our projects and what did not. I have most of the morphs in my collection and can out of experience share my views. I will not stand for name slandering and false accusations.

I Love the topic of leopards and up till today i have created 8 world firsts that I am very excited about.

In my humble opinion you all have viable points.
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Re: To breed or not to breed: Enigmas

Postby Bushviper » Wed Jan 29, 2014 3:39 pm

Okay this pissing contest has gone on long enough. These are pets and will always be pets and will never go back to the wild. Nobody in the entire world cares about how pure their genes are.

If you want to breed them so that they just have two legs or blind I really could not care less. Just advertise them as such. That is all. Many morphs have been produced by crossing strains to see what they produce and often they only produce something wow a generation or two later. If you dont like a certain cross then dont buy it. It is that simple. If I want to cross albinos then leave me to do it. If you dont like it dont buy from me. That is how the market works. If these are a lethal gene and they die a week later then I lose a customer. Until then it is my customer. He can then come here and tell about his experiences with me. It is not up to anyone to speculate on what might happen or not.

Motley boas are a lethal gene and a super motley will die. Everyone knows that. Except that I have a picture of a female super motley giving birth to more supers as well as some hypo motleys.

This thread is now locked.
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