Getting Leo's Legal in Cape Town

Re: Getting Leo's Legal in Cape Town

Postby Bushviper » Thu Mar 26, 2015 11:30 am

The answer is pretty simple. Get a recognised expert in this field to do a risk assessment study. Then have it reviewed by at least two other high ranking scientists. If the results are favourable then submit these to the permit office at Cape nature and ask them to review the policy they have as it will have been based on flawed science. That way you can then push to get these lizards and really make a lot of noise (depending on the outcome of the research).
It is easier to ask for forgiveness than permission.

Those who are afraid to ask are ashamed of learning.
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Re: Getting Leo's Legal in Cape Town

Postby Mathandanyoka » Thu Mar 26, 2015 6:36 pm

Hello slangkop

I know that this thread is about legalising geckos in the Cape and perhaps you’re misinterpreting my reply so there is no reason to be hostile. I am not looking for an argument or a debate. I am merely passing on what I know.

I’m neither a breeder nor a seller of reptiles but I have had dealings with the DEA to some extent as it’s part of my job to issue permits. I am also an Environmental Management Inspectorate mandated to enforce NEMA, NEMBA, NEMPA etc.… and Bushviper has hit the nail on the head.

Do yourself a favour and read NEMBA- Invasive Species Regulations Gazetted 19 July 2013 Chapter six:
“Alien and Invasive Species under section 97(1) of the National
Environmental Management: Biodiversity Act, 2004 (Act No. 10 of 2004), in the Schedule hereto.“

Which I hope will help answer some of your answers and if you need more info, I'm sure the guys from CapeNature can assist you further.

WESTERN CAPE – www.capenature.co.za

The Western Cape Nature Conservation Board trading as CapeNature

Postal address: CapeNature, Private Bag X 29, Gatesville, 7766
Physical address: PGWC Shared Service Center, c/o. Bosduif & Volstruis Streets,
Bridgetown, 7764
Tel: (021) 483-0118/0120/21/22/23
Switchboard: (021) 483-0000
Direct fax: Permit section: 086 556 7734
E-mail: permits.fax@capenature.co.za
For any permit enquiries contact: Deon Hignett - dhignett@capenature.co.za or Danelle Kleinhans – dkleinhans@capenature.co.za
Application forms and payment advise available from their webpages.

Green Scorpions or Law Enforcement Officers:
• Paul Gildenhuys: Manager Biodiversity Enforcement (Jonkershoek); pgilden@kingsley.co.za or 021 866-8012 or 082 551 8312
• Johann Oelofse: Conservation Services (George); (044) 802-5316 or 082 411 5445
• Carl Brown: Conservation Services (Belville); brownc@mweb.co.za or (021) 957-5920 or 082 784 8718
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Re: Getting Leo's Legal in Cape Town

Postby Slangkop » Fri Mar 27, 2015 8:48 am

@ Mathandanyka:
I am glad you finally changed your mind and agree that cape nature is the correct body to approach to!
It's just a bit disappointing that you,as a professional,couldn't give any proper answers to my questions,which were not meant in hostility.
Lots of copy and paste,but very little useful information coming there from your side.
Who are you trying to impress?
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Re: Getting Leo's Legal in Cape Town

Postby Slangkop » Mon Mar 30, 2015 11:20 am

Ok guys,i just red through that post again and came to the conclusion that i went overboard a little.
I would like to apologise to Clarkie and Mathandanyoka for that!
I really mean it and hope you will be able to accept my apology.
Also thanks to Westely for pointing it out to me.
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Re: Getting Leo's Legal in Cape Town

Postby Clarkie » Mon Mar 30, 2015 2:36 pm

Slangkop wrote:Ok guys,i just red through that post again and came to the conclusion that i went overboard a little.
I would like to apologise to Clarkie and Mathandanyoka for that!
I really mean it and hope you will be able to accept my apology.
Also thanks to Westely for pointing it out to me.


:-D its no problem. Its human nature to react differently.

But the ones to blame are CapeNature as they are infuriating the genuine reptile owners who want to do things the proper way and not go behind their back and own a reptile that is labeled as illegal...

#BroHug -> :smt021

Anyway, I can only think of Bjorn to do a reptile risk assessment and maybe get one of the UCT researchers who as noted above should be highly ranked and then from there assess and submit, if it passes, to Cape Nature.

Obviously Bjorn is gonna need funding for this?
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Re: Getting Leo's Legal in Cape Town

Postby Mathandanyoka » Mon Mar 30, 2015 6:14 pm

No worries but thanks, Slangkop! Apology appreciated and accepted. I can empathise and understand where you are coming from as we’re all pretty much in the same boat. It’s incredibly annoying with the goal posts constantly being shifted regarding which species must be listed and are safe and those that aren't, new amendments, blah, blah, blah,,,,,,,. It’s confusing and no one really understands what is going on.
@ Clarkie:
I’m in no way defending CapeNature or any other conservation bodies in SA but the blame can’t be entirely directed at them as all of this new legislation has been born out of necessity because there are greedy people out there that have made it difficult for us.

I can only that things will slowly begin to improve for all us!
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Re: Getting Leo's Legal in Cape Town

Postby Savu » Mon Mar 30, 2015 8:01 pm

Hi mathandanyoka,when you say there are greedy people out there making things difficult,you obviously mean government officials???
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Re: Getting Leo's Legal in Cape Town

Postby Westley Price » Tue Mar 31, 2015 8:17 am

Well done for acknowledging the mistake you made, Slangkop. Now the topic can move on on a constructive trend.

A debate is healthy, but one has to keep emotions out of it and not attack the characters of others.

I have removed my comment above in the spirit of keeping the topic "clean."
"I am dying by inches from not having anybody to talk to about insects." - Charles Darwin
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Re: Getting Leo's Legal in Cape Town

Postby Slangkop » Tue Mar 31, 2015 10:31 am

Thanks guys...i appreciate it and feeling much better now!
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Re: Getting Leo's Legal in Cape Town

Postby Mathandanyoka » Wed Apr 01, 2015 7:06 pm

Savu wrote:Hi mathandanyoka,when you say there are greedy people out there making things difficult,you obviously mean government officials???

Good point. I was aiming more towards dealers and breeders involved in illegal trading that have created the necessity but ja, government officials included.
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Re: Getting Leo's Legal in Cape Town

Postby Clarkie » Thu Apr 02, 2015 8:45 am

I have spoken to Bjorn and he said he would be happy to help us but wont be willing to pay the full amount so can we get together and sort out funding? Im sure theres quite a number of people willing to help get Leo's legal here?
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Re: Getting Leo's Legal in Cape Town

Postby Slangkop » Thu Apr 02, 2015 9:18 am

How much are we talking about here?
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Re: Getting Leo's Legal in Cape Town

Postby Clarkie » Thu Apr 02, 2015 9:34 am

Slangkop wrote:How much are we talking about here?


Well Bjorn said the last time he did an assessment it was around 1000.

So obviously to fill that we need quite a few members. It cant just be you, me and Bjorn. We need more people unless you willing to pay about 350 :-)
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Re: Getting Leo's Legal in Cape Town

Postby Slangkop » Thu Apr 02, 2015 10:15 am

That is much less then i thought!
Personally,i am not really interested in keeping leos,but would be willing to give R100 just to help the cause.
I would also be happy to pay R350 towards a risk assessment for green iguanas.
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