Crote hybrids

[croteseeker]

I recently had a discussion on another forum regarding hybrid crotes. I figured I'd post a few photos here to see if you guys could guess what they were.I'll start with the first three that come to mind, and add some more over time. Please feel free to join in by posting any hybrid photos you may have so that we can try and determine the parent species. All I ask is that you mention whether the animal in your photo is wild or not, as the pet trade can get pretty crazy with the crotes.

Note: None of the following are my photos. All of these animals were found in the wild, by reputable herpers.

1)

NOT MY PHOTO by crotalus_cerberus83, on Flickr

2)

NOT MY PHOTO by crotalus_cerberus83, on Flickr

3)

NOT MY PHOTO by crotalus_cerberus83, on Flickr


Good luck, guys!

[TJ&ACP]

I’ll go for the following:

1)Crotalus atrox/ Crotalus oreganus

2)Crotalus Lepidus/ Crotalus atrox

3) No Idea

[croteseeker]

Well, TJ, you're halfway there on the two that you guessed. You got one of the parent species for both numbers one and two. I'll give you a hint about number three: Laurence Klauber once considered it as a new species of montane rattlesnake endemic to AZ.

[TJ&ACP]

As far as the hint, the other two rattles that occur in AZ are to my knowledge are
Crotalus mitchellii stephensi - Southwestern speckled rattlesnake
and
Crotalus tigris - Tiger rattlesnake

[croteseeker]

As far as the hint, the other two rattles that occur in AZ are to my knowledge are
Crotalus mitchellii stephensi - Southwestern speckled rattlesnake
and
Crotalus tigris - Tiger rattlesnake

C. mitchelli pyrrhus (stephensi is the panamint, and is no longer a subspecies of mitchelli) and C. tigris are two of them, but there are also molossus, cerberus, willardi, pricei, and lepidus. (Some people only count the last three, since they are the only ones that are found strictly at high altitude, but even the others that are found nearer to sea level are still found almost exclusively in rocky, mountainous areas.) That last animal was thought to be a fourth "Sky Islands" montane, Crotalus apache. Their real identities are as follows:

1) C. atrox x C. molossus molossus

2) C. pricei pricei x C. lepidus klauberi

3) C. willardi willardi x C. lepidus klauberi


Now for a couple more. One fairly common, the other not so much.

4) Wild caught, but more common in the pet trade...

NOT MY PHOTO by crotalus_cerberus83, on Flickr

5) Captive bred, and the first I've heard of...

NOT MY PHOTO by crotalus_cerberus83, on Flickr

Good luck!

[wadekilian]

Is the first C. horridus x C. adamanteus? The second looks like C. atrox x C. viridis / C. abyssus / C. scutulatus?

[croteseeker]

Wade, you've got one of them dead on. The other one, you've got half correct.

I'll wait until tonight to reveal these guys' identities, so TJ or someone else can try.

[croteseeker]

A few more for you guys to guess at. Not all of them are Crotalus spp., but crotalines, anyway. All captive bred.

6)

NOT MY PHOTO by crotalus_cerberus83, on Flickr

7)

NOT MY PHOTO by crotalus_cerberus83, on Flickr

8)

NOT MY PHOTO by crotalus_cerberus83, on Flickr

Good luck!

[kfc223]

Well here's my attempt.

6. Agkistrodon contortrix x Agkistrodon piscivorus

7. Agkistrodon contortrix x Agkistrodon bilineatus/Agkistrodon taylori

8. Crotalus adamanteus x Crotalus atrox or maybe Crotalus scutulatus

[croteseeker]

Well done, KFC!!! You got all 3 of them. The last one is, in fact, atrox x adamanteus.

Any guesses on four and five?

[kfc223]

I'll give it a try.

4. I'm pretty sure that's Crotalus horridus x Crotalus adamanteus.

Here's a picture of an adult that belonged to Albert Coritz(Aka Viperkeeper)

Photo Albert Coritz

5. I'm going to go for Crotalus atrox x Crotalus mitchellii stephensi.

[croteseeker]

Well done, man! You got all of them. I had hoped it would be tougher than that for some of those.

Here's one more. Captive bred.


NOT MY PHOTO by crotalus_cerberus83, on Flickr

If anyone here has any difficult to identify crote hybrids/morphs for us to guess at, feel free to post here.

[wadekilian]

Looks like Lachesis muta x Deinagkistrodon acutus / Atropoides mexicanus?

[Bushviper]

These get rather confusing. I am just glad nobody is getting bitten by these hybrids because I do believe the venoms might be rather potent.

[croteseeker]

They certainly do get confusing.

As nasty as a bite from atrox, adamanteus, or molossus would be, I'd rather not even think about the difficulties in treating a bite from a hybrid. The only good bright spot is in polyvalent antivenins, but I'm sure that by mixing highly potent venom with massive size (and resultant venom yield), you could really give modern medicine a run for it's money.