Heating issues

[Unforgiven]

I seem to be having a problem with heating. In summer temps were very well and no heat mats or cables were needed. Now as autumn is approaching there is a span of a couple of warm days and then all of a sudden a cold day.

I recently buit a +-2m high cage which is subdivided into 9 1m long cages. Im using a heat cable that previously got me temps of around 33 without a thermostat but this was when it was placed inside a cage. I am now using it on the 2m high cage running it up along the side and then down again on the centre of the cages. It is against hardboard but for some reason my temps get as low as 18 celcius. This has already led to 2 regurges in the past 2 weeks. should I place the heat cable closer together or should I add in a heater for the entire room in addition to the cable. If so what heater should I use to avoid a drop in ambient humidity? I think I read somehwere that an oil based heater is the way to go?

I understand a drop in temps is good especially for breeding king snakes and milks snakes but at the moment none of them are quite near breeding size and the corns do fine without cooling

[froot]

You need a heat mat at one end of each enclosure, regardless of the air temperature the snake can still lie on the heat mat and digest it's food. It also sounds like your snake room is badly insulated from the elements if the temperature swings so wildly and your heating cable setup is making very little difference.

[Tyronen]

I think it would be best to try maintain the cage temperatures without any external room heaters.

What I would do is add some more heating cable and connect it to a digital thermostat +- R400. Also experiment with the placement of the cable. You want to try create a temperature gradient instead of just one constant temperature. You can place the digital thermostat sensor probe in one of the top cages near the heating wire where it’s likely to be the warmest since heat rises and will keep the cages all in sync. This will ensure the safety of all your snakes and keep them nice and cosy for winter. Another option I find that tends to work really well for me is 14w-20w foil heating pads all hooked up to a digital thermostat instead of heating wire.

[Unforgiven]

I was thinking of getting those little foil pads, but with the cages being a meter long I am worried about the cool end being too cool.

I recently moved and the room they are kept in is a lot larger than the previous one and probably not very well insulated.

My plan with the heater wasnt just to use a heater to keep the snakes happy but rather say keep the room at a constant 23 to 24 and then use supplementary heating controlled via a thermostat to given them a nice warm spot.

I will spot around and see if I can find any of those small heating pads. They get sold here where I stay for 100 bux a pop, so shipping them in might be the better equivalent

In the meantime I will play around with cable positions and see what I can work out

[Unforgiven]

How sufficient would a 9w 200mm x 150mm heat mat be?

[Tyronen]

Just an idea for the foil heating pads if you worried about one side of the take being too cool. Add 2 pads per cage, one as a hot spot for the snake to lie on and one you can stick to the side of the cage or even the ceiling of the cage. This should boost the overal temps enough and can still be all controlled by a digital thermostat.

A 9w foil pad may be too little rather a 14w pad. Also what I do is place a ceramic floor tile (similar size to the foil pad) over the foil pad. This helps retain the heat and evens it out where the snake lies. If you are going to use the foil heaters then you need to place the digital thermostat sensor probe on top of the ceramic floor tile and use some tape to stick it fast. A 14w pad goes for about R50-R60 in Joburg. Have a look at the ReptileCity online shop, they can ship to you in EL.

[Unforgiven]

Thanks for the info, I have been looking at the higher wattage pads, but with the floor space in each tank I need something less than 20cm wide. I will have another look at reptile city although I have been looking at what Edward has and he has some really nice pads for like 30 bux.

I am still in seacrh of a digital thermostat. I only know of the ATC300 that reptile city sells and that is currently out of stock. I will keep looking, but are there any suggested models?

[NewtTZ]

To maintain higher temps you can use low wattage basking lights placed on one side of the cage. I have used this method with snakes before that are kept in larger cages. You can attach a dimmer switch ( cheap from any hardware store) to the basking light to control the heat output manually. Just make sure the bulbs are out of reach of the snake. I sell exo-terra bulbs if you are interested and ship nationwide http://www.timsreptiles.co.za

[Tyronen]

@Unforgiven - Private Message BradMiller on the forum. He sells a great unit TC-200 for around R410. I picked one up 2 weeks ago and it's excellent. This unit is Digital and can do different temps during the day and night. Check this link to see what it looks like: http://littleflyfish.m.ec21.com/mobile/ ... Id=7001233

[Unforgiven]

Ah yes! I had forgotten about Brads thermostats, thanks for reminding me.

On a side note about the 9 watt heat mats - I am almost 100% percent sure I have some at home in some of my other smaller cages. They have the same dimensions and they produce ample heat, infact a little too much at times (35 degrees on really hot days) but during winter they keep a steady 27-29 degrees. When I asked Edward he said they should produce about 30 degrees. In any case I will try the idea of putting a second heat mat on the other end and on the ceiling and hooking everything up to a thermostat like Brad's one

@newt I had thought about that too, but there cages are setup with more sort of leg room than head room and so they would be able to reach a basking light fairly easily. Those are some very good products that you have there though.

[Serpent]

The first thing to do, like Froot said is check your room and its temps. I have resorted to regulating the temps within my room which has helped make everything a lot more consistent and easier. Your room should be set up for all seasons which takes all the guess work out, and will make your life a lot less stressful easier.

[bradmiller]

Try and have an ambient temp of 22-23 degrees then have hot spots in your cage - the snake will move to where they are comfortable.
Maintaining temperature is a tricky thing and many people over or under compensate especially on very large cages or rack systems.
Air flow also has a huge effect on temperature, so any drafts will suck out all the heat and not enough will make a hot box that can "cook" your snakes.

You need to play around with settings and placements to get the right temperature gradients. A Simple thing like natural sunshine and insulation also have huge affect on maintaining temperature
A thermostat is only a simple device that can also be ineffective if used improperly or with the wrong type of heating. Probe placement is also very crucial - again to need to play around a bit to get it right. Correct setup and testing of that setup is key to having a reasonable assurance that its "maintenance" free. That being said its always advisable to have 2nd and even 3rd fail safes

see topic:
http://www.sareptiles.co.za/forum/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=5808&start=0&hilit=Disaster+fire

Speedheat have very nice system that is waterproof and only reaches a maximum temp of around 40 degrees - if I remember correctly.
You can install it at the entire bottom part of your cages and set that with a thermostats to 23 degrees. That should maintain the temp and use lights for basking or hot spots

[Unforgiven]

I am at a loss for words after reading through all the posts in that link Brad O_O

There has definitely been a lot of food for thought provided to me today. Definitely going to use the knowledge gained for when I do any future cage builds.

One thing I am definitely going to start including in future builds is "false floors" so as to keep all heating equipment and wires kept safely away. Brad, you have a PM about the thermo stats. I won't be able to afford 2 right this very moment, but I would like to have safeguards. While my collection may not be as important as everyone elses, I know how hard I have worked to acquire everything and to lose everything in a freak accident like the above would be devastating!