Cape Reptile Club

[Rodwraylva]

Thanks for the info

[Andrew]

… hidden agendas and petty issues..

I had prier business commitments so was unfortunately unable to attend the formation of a new W/Cape Herp/Reptile association who met this month to form a committee.
Why all of a sudden is there this mad hasty scramble to quickly create an independent group who will no doubt divide and weaken the entire province with an uncoordinated agenda?

… "hijack" the process in the WC. ..

True words Bushviper but keep in mind that history has shown that having a divided house due to petty personal politics will ultimate drive the serious keepers away.
This “hijack” is certainly not being done for the interest of the W/Cape reptile community.

[Rodwraylva]

WCHA had their meet lastweek, and now CRC is having theirs in the near future, people of the general public, what is your opinion on 2 different groups running for "power" both with the same aim, which is to get retile keeping in WC in order, and to get cape nature to answer our calls with more productive answers. I think it will not work if we are devided, I think that we should rather have a sit down between the committees of the two groups to get into agreement and join fact, as if CRC requests cape nature and then WCHA requests cape nature, cape nature will be closed to both parties at the end, cape nature iwll just toss both of us under the rug and act asthough we do not exist. So I believe we should get to an agreement, the best way to approach this is by having a whole new commitee run this "super organisation" with which the members will be the voters of, as was done at the WCHA meet, because if any of the people who where incharge of the old groups where staying in their old posisions will just cause a problem with some of the members, and will cause another divide.

Lets hope the lot of us can come to an agreement and just get over the differences you may have with anyone involved in any group.

[it_bit_me]

You guys should call it the "Cape Town Herp Assn." and "Cape Town Reptile Club". Please guys, stop doing the funky monkey and get to the issues that affect the rest of us.

[Loslappie]

what is your opinion on 2 different groups running for "power" both with the same aim, which is to get retile keeping in WC in order, and to get cape nature to answer our calls with more productive answers.

This is not a political race, running for power?
The restarting of the Cape Reptile Club is not to counter any organisation.
Leave it at that please. I am not about start a petty and groundless debate with anyone.

And "Andrew", please do not take qoutes out of context.

[TonyK]

if CRC requests cape nature and then WCHA requests cape nature, cape nature will be closed to both parties at the end, cape nature iwll just toss both of us under the rug and act asthough we do not exist.

Rodwraylva did Cape Nature tell you this or did you just dream it up while sitting in front of your PC?
Please do not insult us with these type of statments.

[chamcode]

I have been watching posts about getting the herpers in the Western Cape together and although I cannot vouch for the motivation of any of the organisers trying to get this done, I was aware of three different people wanting to form a group, all of them posting the idea within a similar time period (May 4th, May 27th and May 30th). I have up until recently, known very little about the "politics" involved, and believe that there are/were many people like me. Since I want to be involved in such a group, I contacted all three.

The view that a single group cannot work due to differences between individuals, or that two groups will be counter productive, doesn’t constitute fact. Those of us who are not fully aware of the history, should be given the opportunity to figure this out for ourselves and the people who do know the history should apply wisdom when going about managing their differences, or commenting on the differences of others.

[TonyK]

The view that a single group cannot work due to differences between individuals, or that two groups will be counter productive, doesn’t constitute fact. Those of us who are not fully aware of the history, should be given the opportunity to figure this out for ourselves and the people who do know the history should apply wisdom when going about managing their differences, or commenting on the differences of others.

Chamcode I agree 100% with you .I would say that the large majority of us do not know the full history between the different factions but it seems clear that one group is not going to work at this point in time.

[Loslappie]

The whole thing has in my opinion been blown out of proportion and out of context.

In my opinion, this is not a popularity contest where groups have to motivate why people should attend their meetings or support their cause. If a group of individuals with like minded ideas want to revive a club that has existed, and beleive it has potential they have that right, if people like what they see they should feel free to join. But if as in this case some do not agree or see eye to eye with an individual in that group, people should respect that and not question why they can set aside their differences, as you probably will not like the answer you will receive, and base assumptions on that.

I always encourage people to find things out for themselves but if they ask for my opinion, I will offer it as my personal one, and not that of a group or club, unless expressly stated.

The Cape reptile Club as we knew it will as indicated have a meeting, an invitation will be sent out and I dont think it should have any bearing on any association. Like I said, if your cause is noble, you will have your support.

[Rodwraylva]

Loslappie, the "power" I am refering to is just slight compitition, as I think Cape Nature would not be very happy if 2 indipendent parties come to them with the same problem, I think that would cause Cape Nature to just close down to both parties. And due to that happening the one party will try to push the other down resulting in a larger divide.

TonyK, what do you think will happen if two parties have the same goal, and try to reach it independently? I am just stating what I think will happen, as if we are on different opinions, even if we are on the same ones, Cape Nature will at a point get tired of 2 parties getting involved with the same cause. I just think that we need to et everybody under the same name, same banner, and get our voice out in 1 unit, with sub units for like a keepers sub association, and so on, as the chairman has a strong view towards a certain subject, he will more eagerly adress that, and be less knowledgable for the needs of others, so we need to get something going where everyone is together and each with individual needs would be treated in different groups that are their to care for those who just keeps snakes and do not rescue snakes, then there must be something for those who just rescue snakes, and then you can be under both if you do both. The main point being we must act and speak as one unit, but have smaler units to adress specific problems.

And yes, this is all just my opinion, pretty much sucked out of my thumb, but this is what my logic thinks will happen at some point. And even if you have the slight politics, we need a new generation to run this who has no involvement in the politics, who are still changed out every few years, and the older guys are just there to say but when we tried this this happened, so that we can be aware of all possibilities. There will always be someone who you dislike in any orginization, as an example, Shaun, but the moment you will not join a club because Shaun is giving advice on how Cape Nature works, you are not just spiting him, or yourself, you are breaking down the whole group, because then you want to be appart of a totally seperate association/club which will be on its own, starting over and then making the existing party loose people who, if all just got along in association/clug meetings, would have been able to work past that and create an better outcome when working as one unit.

[Loslappie]

Rodwralva, please get the idea of competition out of this equation.
If two parties, have the same goal then it shouldnt be a problem, as the authorities will then take note.
Unfortunately as Ive told you many times before, there are people who do not want to be associated with a specific person, and they will not join any association that person is involved in. There is a spot in the sun for everybody, accept that.
Please this is becoming exhausting as the same thing is being repeated and we are not getting anywhere.
Please leave it at that..

[jka]

Talk about starting up or reviving the CRC has been going on for sometime now. Then all of a sudden this "new" association pops up.

The thing is that certain people have the need to make themselves feel better so always try to compete with other and at the end certain people will always make it a personal attack. I don't know why but that is just how it goes.

I don't see the issue with two associations its not suppose to be a power struggle but now that it has been brought up. What club or association will Cape Nature rather support?, the one who's founder apparently knows how they work and function but still doesn't bother with applying for a rehab permit to do catch and release? The one who got raided but unfortunately was tipped of and got rid of the hordes of illegal snakes and only had a corn left? The one that was mixed up with the whole sending snakes through the post, without permits (don't think it was proved). The person that has a bad reputation and track record. The person that knows it all about legislation but has been put right so many.

I know who I'm going for it might not be clear enough for others at this stage.

And alas the above is just my personal view and opinion.

let's see how it goes.

[atropos]

Well said jka, I think it's important to know why there is such a lack of support for said person and perhaps why there is an abrasive nature between CN and him.

Reviving the CRC seems to make so much more sense but as you say, there is jealousy involved. But as someone said before each individual must find this out for themselves, and they have every right to, but they should be aware that there is good (not petty hidden agenda - like) reason for those who wish not to associate.

[Bushviper]

In Gauteng we have 3 (possibly 4) reptile clubs and we have no problems meeting with Nature conservation. It is even possible for a national body to also get involved in any negotiations with Cape Nature as has happened in the past.

You need to work out what your issues are and come up with suggestions which would be acceptable to Cape Nature so that if changes have to be made to policy or legislation then they will be able to motivate it. If you just want a bitching session or want to make accusations then rather just stay at home because you are wasting everyone's time.

[Hoss]

It appears folks down in the cape need to work out their issues with each other first before they can work out any issues with Cape Nature. Just saying.